From:
"jrusert" <jrusert@adelphia.net>
Sent: 10/27/2000 4:31:58 AM
To:
gpsstash@egroups.com
Cc:
Bcc:
Subject:

Re: [gpsstash] Sierra Club posts


I think most of these people are in need of a life, a GPS; and/or both!

--Jim

If the nations economists where laid end to end, they would point in all
directions.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Teague"
To: "gpsstash"
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 8:43 AM
Subject: [gpsstash] Sierra Club posts


> Here are some highlights I've recieved in the email so far...
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: Post List-SC-OA-GC,
INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 2:16 PM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> The site requires registration, but it's free and well worth the price of
> registration...geostashing is the internet game which involves stashing
> items in the wilds, posting the information about their location on the
web,
> then having others locate the stash using a GPS unit. Supposedly, this
> involves beautiful views, rock climbing, etc., but if this catches on and
> becomes a fad, it will clearly impact environmentally sensitive ecosystems
> where these stashes are located or along the possible routes to these
> stashes.
>
> Don Pachner
> Sierra Club Lower Hudson Group
> Executive Committee
> BoG Delegate
> Chair, Trails Committee
> Leader, Atlantic Chapter Outings Committee
> Atlantic Chapter Webmaster
> Chair, Atlantic Chapter IT Committee
> (914) 234-6618
> mailto:donp@bestweb.net
> CHECK OUT OUR WEB SITE AT www.atlantic.sierraclub.org
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List
> [mailto:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG]On Behalf Of Andrew
> Johnson
> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2000 1:37 PM
> To: OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> Subject: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> At 6:58 AM -0700 10/26/00, Donald C. Pachner wrote:
> >Should the club be taking a position on the geostashing fad? I think
that
> >this kind of off-trail bushwhacking can impact environmentally sensitive
> >areas if it becomes widespread. See today's New York Times about this
> >trend. http://www.nytimes.com/2000/10/26/technology/26HUNT.html
>
> NYT site requires registration. Can you post a summary here? Or at
> least a definition of "geostashing"?
>
> - andrew johnson, Berkeley California
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: (unknown), INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 5:28 PM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> Owen,
> According to the geostashing.com site and the NY Times article, it's
> encouraged on public lands, both national and state park land. It may be
> illegal, but how would it be enforced? Also, if it becomes a popular
sport,
> like snowmobiling and off-road ATVs, the special interests may push for
> legalization of some sort. Do you think an early club position on this
> would make sense?
> Don
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: (unknown), INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 7:14 PM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> At 5:35 PM -0400 10/26/00, Donald C. Pachner wrote:
> >Owen,
> >According to the geostashing.com site and the NY Times article, it's
> >encouraged on public lands, both national and state park land. It may be
> >illegal, but how would it be enforced? Also, if it becomes a popular
> sport,
> >like snowmobiling and off-road ATVs, the special interests may push for
> >legalization of some sort. Do you think an early club position on this
> >would make sense?
> >Don
>
> Well, the Club position is that the USFS and other agencies should
> enforce the law. They can't legalize snowmobiles in wilderness, much
> though they might try. Leaving stuff in public territory is
> littering. It's a criminal offense. Support your local police.
>
> Send them all a recording of Alice's Restaurant. Club members can
> take lots of color-glossy pictures with circles and arrows and
> writing on the back. :)
>
> Practically speaking, if it becomes a problem, we can run cleanup
> trips. Stuff left in public territory probably does not belong to the
> owner any more.
>
> The eastern and western situation is different, because you guys
> don't have as much federal land as westerners do. But I would think
> eastern local governments would frown on it. The stuff left could be
> booby-trapped. It could encourage leaving stuff on private land,
> which is trespassing. It could be used to lure people for robbery or
> worse. People will rob the stuff and wait for victims.
>
> I think letters to the NY Times from your groups should bring these
> objections up. It's a environmental issue, sure, but I think it's
> more a police issue.
>
> It is a good idea to teach snowmobilers to use a GPS so they can stay
> where they are supposed to be. But first we have to teach them to use
> common sense. One of them here ran into a deep volcanic crater, with
> attendant disarrangement of driver and machine.
> --
> ---------------------------------
> Owen Maloy
> ---------------------------------
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: (unknown), INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 10:16 PM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> At 06:19 PM 10/26/00, Dennis Richards wrote:
> >Norman Clyde, a Sierra Club member, leader and notorious "stasher" would
> not
> >be welcome in our Club any longer??? Sigh.
>
> I was trying to avoid adding to this thread, but it does point out a
> dangerous trend: I keep hearing from people who want to close the
> backcountry entirely. The SFBay chapter voted on (but didn't pass)
> a resolution asking the feds to close all wilderness areas to all
> human entry forever. The Loma Prieta chapter DID pass a resolution
> asking parks and forests to raise entry fees to a prohibitive level
> as a way of reducing human use.
>
> Muir understood well that the best way to keep someone from sinking
> your boat is to offer them a ride. People who don't KNOW the wild
> will not vote to preserve it. Lock everyone out, fight every form
> of access, and you'll wind up with roads and development instead.
>
> Think of the big picture, people! A few nerds running around the
> backcountry is NOTHING compared to the hunters and fishers and just
> plain walking-around-folks. Anything that gets anyone out to enjoy
> the true wilderness (and I'm NOT talking about Golden Gate Park)
> is a win for those who wish to preserve that wilderness. Talk all you
> want about loving it to death, but don't let people forget it's there.
>
> SRE
>
> mailto:eckert@climber.org | http://www.climber.org/eckert/
> Info on peak climbing email lists mailto:info@climber.org
>
> It may be that your whole purpose in life
> is simply to serve as a warning to others.
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: (unknown), INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 7:43 PM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> At 3:38 PM -0700 10/26/00, Carol Vellutini wrote:
> >Would stating a club position then give geostashing more publicity? I
never
> >heard of it and I don't think I want people here to know about it. Maybe
> >they Have????
> >Carol Vellutini- Redwood Chapter
>
> It would for sure increase search and rescue expenses in your chapter
> (and mine). One could, however, regard this as a Darwinian process
> the public should support.
>
> Owen Maloy
> Toiyabe Chapter
> --
> ---------------------------------
> Owen Maloy
> ---------------------------------
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: Dennis Richards, INTERNET:gohfrit@earthlink.net
> TO: (unknown), INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 9:23 PM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> Does this mean we cannot stash food for long backpacks, stash gear when we
> go off to climb, stash a rope and climbing gear when we return to the same
> area next week, stash trail building tools for use next week? I guess
> Norman Clyde, a Sierra Club member, leader and notorious "stasher" would
not
> be welcome in our Club any longer??? Sigh.
>
> Dennis Richards
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: (unknown), INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/26/2000 10:09 PM
>
> RE: Geostashing - NOT!
>
>
> I am instinctively opposed to this Geostashing concept.
>
> Although I, myself, have stashed up to 7 gallons of water in various
> parts of Grand Canyon this new variation sounds like nothing more than a
> game.
>
> Out here in the overrated Colorado Rockies (Ed Abbey's words) we've
> turned our 54 14ers into stair-steppers.
>
> I vote for more wilderness and less games...
>
> Roger J. Wendell
> http://www.rogerwendell.org
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
>
> From: "Chapter, Group and Section Outing Leader Discussion List",
> INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> TO: Post List-SC-OA-GC,
INTERNET:OA-GC-OUTINGS-LEADERS@LISTS.SIERRACLUB.ORG
> DATE: 10/27/2000 12:28 AM
>
> RE: Re: Position on Geostashing?
>
>
> At 6:19 PM -0700 10/26/00, Dennis Richards wrote:
> >Does this mean we cannot stash food for long backpacks, stash gear when
we
> >go off to climb, stash a rope and climbing gear when we return to the
same
> >area next week, stash trail building tools for use next week? I guess
> >Norman Clyde, a Sierra Club member, leader and notorious "stasher" would
> not
> >be welcome in our Club any longer??? Sigh.
> >
> >Dennis Richards
> >
>
> These are Forest Service, not Club regulations. And trail-building,
> being a USFS-sponsored activity, would not be affected.
> --
> ---------------------------------
> Owen Maloy
> ---------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> Mike Teague - http://www.triax.com/yngwie
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The gpsstash page
> http://www.geocaching.com
> The GPS Stash Hunt page.
> http://www.triax.com/~yngwie/gps.html
>
> GeoCache HQ
> http://www.braveheart.com.au
> GPS Stash Hunt FAQ :
> http://www.triax.com/~yngwie/stashfaq.txt
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>
>
>