"Mike Teague" <>
Sent: 6/12/2000 6:17:38 PM
"David J. Ulmer" <>

Re: [gpsstash] Problems with GeoCaching...

So just to be clear.. you want all your stashes removed from the webpages?
(have you already recovered them all? or will you be?) if so, that sucks. I
wanted to go try the williams lake and lookout tree stashes on wednesday,
yet again.. :)

I really do think you're overreacting. I sincerely doubt anyone's going to
be prosecuted for littering.. I know I'm not worried about it. (how many
letterboxers have been fined? they're doing the exact same thing.) You can
do an urban stash, it's just going to take creativity to find a place to put
it... Look at the divine stash you placed. It's 100 feet from an interstate
freeway.. what's wrong with that? why couldn't you plant a plastic bottle or
something in a planter bed in downtown portland? There's no need to put your
name on anything, if you really dont want to..

what's the difference between "wonderts" and just plain old waypoint lists ?
there doesn't seem to be any sport to it..

You're quitting geocaching altogether? I am just about as involved in it as
you are, and don't see the problems with it that you have.. I dont see why
you need to "take your ball and go home" because cybercaching was not
embraced with the same enthusiasm that the original game was...

Whatever the case, Geocaching / GPS Stash Hunting will go on, I'm pretty
sure... I enjoyed hunting for and finding your stashes, but I'm sure someone
else is out there to put new ones out around Portland ;)

Good luck in your new endeavor...

Mike Teague -
GPS Stash Hunt (Geocache) Homepage -

-----Original Message-----
From: David J. Ulmer
To: Gpsstash
Date: Monday, June 12, 2000 4:58 PM
Subject: [gpsstash] Problems with GeoCaching...

>You really don't see the problems with a sport until you get deeply
>in it. As the one that has placed the most stashes so far, I began to see
>the problems that it created. Some of my stashes are placed on tree farms
>owned by a large corporation. They are not, No Trespassing areas but they
>are private property. I didn't think too much about it at first because
>woods is woods around here, and a cache bucket seems like a pretty benign
>thing. The problem I saw was with the published coordinates attached to an
>uninvited bucket attached to my name could some day cause trouble. Some
>corporate dude five years from now could decide to prosecute me for
>littering or something just for the fun of it. For that reason I've decided
>to remove the stash buckets but keep the coordinates that are interesting
>for another game.
>The second major problem I found with geocaching was that you couldn't
>easily place them in urban areas or other areas of special interest. One of
>the goals I had for geocaching was to attract people to some of those
>"special spots" that only local people know about. I know of many unique
>spots in the urban area that I would like to identify for people to visit.
>tried the CyberStashing concept that seemed to solve all the problems, but
>that was a flop, it was too complicated.
>So now I'm on to the Wondert game. Looking for places where just being
>is the reward. I think it might work, I'll let you know when I get back
>vacation. I know my Billy Graham stash would make a good Wondert and
>probably Williams Lake too. The two cyberstashes are certainly candidates.
>I'll see what other Wonderts I can find.
>So go visit my Wonderts and see what you think.
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