"Jeremy Irish" <>
Sent: 9/13/2000 11:11:36 AM

RE: [gpsstash] New features on

Lets end this now. I believe you made your point. I'm talking with the LbNA
team to work out a partnership between the two sites.

As a rebuttal to your advertising "crap" comment, I'm assuming LbNA will be
moving their mailing list off eGroups to maintain the integrity of the game?
If you haven't noticed, there's an ad at the top of every e-mail. Even
yours. It would make more sense if your argument was not flawed.


-------------------------- Jeremy's Sponsor --------------------------
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-----Original Message-----
From: Randy Hall []
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [gpsstash] New features on

> Works for me. Your letterboxes now link direct to your site (or they
> should - I couldn't reach to test it).

My ISP has a flaky router that just rebooted and reboots alot.
Should work for now.

> I was sort of wondering about the copyright issues (and why the North
> America site was using frames to link to letterbox pages).

In the early days, the clue writers were insistent about protecting
their copy. They were worried about other web sites and print
publications generating revenue off of what they were providing for
free. Many still are, and the issue still comes up when someone
offers to do what you do and they refuse it. Happened two months
ago. Many also don't care. I think the point is that it is for
them to decide.

> As for banner advertising, I'll never even hope to recoop the costs of
> working on this project, but if I can at least pay for bandwidth with any
> kind of revenue I get - it is preferable than asking for money.

This is an age old debate. We have it in LbNA as well and have chosen,
at least for the past couple of years, to try to keep letterboxing one
of the few things on the net free of that crap. As for "companies that
provide a service to the group", that is also a bit presumptuous, in
as much as you have provided an ad for a direct competitor to one of
the companies whose employees really made letterboxing take off and
are still instrumental in the hobby and are writing the content that
is drawing eyeballs to a competitor as it turns out in this case
(forgetting the debate on whether its the company or the employees,
for my point it doesn't matter).

Without getting into this further, assuming particular companies are
'appropriate' is too much like playing god for me. Don't take this the
wrong way, just trying to make a point. Again, its too much presumption
perhaps for some.

I realise the need to recoup costs, but I think you have to run it by
the people who's clues you are using first. Since you've honored my
request, I'll stay out of this as long as you only provide links to
my clues, at least until we see how this is going to shake out.

Be aware, though, some people have put some personal cash into the
LbNA project, and perhaps they don't want to see someone else come
along and generate revenue off that effort that is not recycled
into the LbNA project. That will be for those persons to decide,

> My ultimate goal is to increase awareness of both games - letterboxing and
> gps stashing. This can best be done by freely sharing information to all
> game players.

I personally think it could be useful technology, but I think you
should work with the LbNA folks on it (or at least the owners of the
copy) before just republishing stuff and pulling down revenue.

One final note. My opinions only :-) I do alot of weird stuff with
my clues and my server that just will not work if the stuff is republished.
Most letterboxers do not do this stuff, but they might someday. It really
is a bit of a treasure hunt, in many cases alot more than just following
directions to some rock at the end of some trail. Perhaps that is why
I'm more sensitive to it. Doesn't invalidate my points, but thought
you'd like to know where I'm coming from :-)

randy "the mapsurfer"

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