----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Stum" To: Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2001 7:26 PM Subject: Re: [gpsstash] Geocaching and whats to be!
> > >The thing I hate about this kinda internet faction crap, is I _always_ find > >myself in the middle of the debate... > > :-) From day one, Mike... from day one... :) > And I've admired you for admitting that... always diplomatic, but never > afraid to say what you're thinking. "You're a good man, Charlie Brown." > > >I agree with you Matt, that Jeremy has no claim to the word "geocaching", > >but I think he's probably done more for the game than ANY of us, including > >Dave Ulmer... Remember, Dave bailed out after about 5 weeks because I > >wouldn't put his imaginary "cybercaches" on my site... > > But you know the difference between now and then? You didn't tell Dave > that he couldn't build his own web page listing his caches... you didn't > threaten to sue him if he infringed upon the name. You didn't tell me that > I couldn't build my distance calculator... you didn't tell the guy in Australia > to take a leap when he created his page (sorry, I forget the name at the > moment)... you never claimed to be the one and only "official" site for > caching. You shared your data freely, and accepted it from others. You > had a true passion for the *activity* rather than just wanting to make a > name for yourself. The "more the merrier" was the philosophy we all had.
I dont think Jeremy is going after people listing their _own_ caches on their _own_ websites, or even from websites other than geocaching.com.... If he is, he has not a leg to stand on, as far as I can tell...
I did hear the report of navicache.com being told not to use the word geocache.. and that truly has me bothered... I dont mind Jeremy keeping his site copyrighted.. he has alot of original content...
> > What we needed (and still need) was a template for sharing and mirroring > the data on all of the sites. We were still relying on pretty labor-intensive > methods, but it would've been pretty easy to build a common template and > distribute tools in Excel, perl, VBscript, etc. to read and merge the data. > I love brainstorming that sort of thing and would be willing to help. (However, > before I become active again, I want to know that the caching "community" > is willing to stand behind some basic ground rules concerning invalid > locations for caches... which I think is also a major concern of Dave's.) >
I do not know enough about database management to comment... I know that keeping a text file database was somewhat tedious when you and I were working together last year though :)
Jeremy has the database completely automated at this point... All ya do is fill out a form and it's up, pretty much...
Invalid locations have pretty much been figured out, but there are always new people...
> >Perhaps I am the only person who has pleasant thoughts about BOTH of them... > > I've never really talked to him, and I do realize that all of my information > about him is second-hand. I'm reserving my personal judgement based > on the reply I get from him to my e-mail. And even then, I am the type > of person who can disagree with you on issues and still think you're a > pretty swell guy. :) One of my mantras has always been "Argue the > issue, not the person." > > >I just take a step back, look at what the objective of the game is... To get > >some coordinates, go find a box... > > Yup. > > >Jeremy's taken it beyond that, You can get the stash coordinates. he has > >various email systems setup so you can know when your own cache has been > >logged, we can log online, as well as in the cache.. the site is free.. etc. > >etc. Theres no argument that it's a better site than we had, and we'd end up > >with the same complaints, no matter WHO ran it, if it got this good..... > > Oh, sure, you can't please everyone all the time. But, Mike, I can never imagine > you threatening to sue someone because they used the term "geocaching" on > their website.
Nope, I would have never even thought of doing that, and I'm still trying to figure out if Jeremy actually did that... That would be seriously disturbing to me... I sent him an email about 6 hours ago asking him about it... I'll wait till I get a response to figure that one out...
> > Again, I'm not arguing that the features on his site aren't great. But what happens > when/if he suddenly disappears? Sure, the sport will continue, but because a lot > of us have been sitting idle because someone else has claimed to be the one and > only official site it will take us quite a long time to rebuild the features (and data!). > There needs to be a "network" in place of many smaller sites, not just one. If we > design the tools correctly, then you could submit your data to any of a number of > sites and it shouldn't take long for it to automatically propagate to the rest of the > participating sites. >
That sounds interesting, I dont know how to do it, but for some reason I don't think Jeremy would be against that idea.... I guess I could be wrong, but I dont know if anyone's even suggested it to him..
> To be honest, my vision of GPS-based cache hunting was to go even lower tech > in the future, not higher. For example, you'd subscribe to a newsletter. New > members would receive a mailing (snail mail, perhaps, but e-mail is okay too) > containing a simple list of coords, no text, no descriptions, no names. You have > to find the cache to get that info. And then each month you'd receive another > mailing containing the coords added that month. Simple, mysterious, and even > more rewarding to find the caches. But I do realize that idea has some flaws > as well.
That doesn't sound bad at all, but in order for this to be accessable, we need a LOT of caches.. We bascially have a good amount right now... I dont think newsletters would have worked, because most people are lazy... We woulda been probably stuck around 200-500 caches by now, only the die-hards out doing it... Now, perhaps that is good!! .. I dunno!
> > Maybe I should just go back to lurking until I'm feeling less grouchy :) > Matt >
Nah! it is good to hear from ya again!!! it's a bummer that more political nonsense got a discussion going...